My reply to @branbello's rant about HiveBuzz's level classification

in #hivebuzzlast year (edited)

A few days ago, I was called out in this post from @branbello who ranted about the level classification used by HiveBuzz.

Such a post deserves at least a detailed answer, if not a post.

First of all, I do not claim to have any particular marine science skills. It is therefore possible, even highly probable, that my reference points used when approving the different marine characters were biased. In such cases, to compensate for lack of knowledge, history can be of great help to understand why such situations have arisen.

Let's now tackle the controversial "Red Fish".
When it was introduced by SteemitBoard (at that time we were still on the blockchain which name shall not be said anymore) it looked like this:

To quote the Red Fish introduction post:

What about a more cozy environment

Before jumping into the vastness of the ocean and its competitive world, there's nothing like learning to swim with serenity.
Protected by your secure environment, you will be helped and nurtured by some benefactors who will help you grow.
Once hardened to the rules of Steemit, you will break out of your jar and launch yourself at full speed towards new adventures.

So yes, it is obviously the clear water fish (often named goldfish), which was chosen because, as per my childish imagination, it lives protected in its little jar, and our kids (understand their parents) take care of it. It's so cute, isn't it?

For the other levels, there was no consideration of domain, kingdom, phylum, class, order, suborder, families, genus, species or sub-species. I simply reused what was already there on the Steem blockchain when I joined, publicly flaunting my ignorance of the animal classification (and that of the original creator).

TLDR; I wanted to keep it simple, emotionally and visually effective.

Should we change the current marine ranking?

@branbello and science will probably answer "Yes". Some will answer "No", and will back up their reasoning with a bunch of (valid) arguments. The vast majority will not respond because they don't care and feel happy as it is.

Should we have switched to a Hymenoptera naming when forking the original blockchain to Hive?

We brainstormed about it, but it became clear to us that, in the collective imagination about bees, the notion of "role" predominated over that of their "size" and that it simply "did not work".

Therefore, despite the scientific good sense and the possible hunt for heretics that we were going to endure, we kept the existing classification.

Fun has its reasons that reason must ignore.


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The ranking system has been in place for years and I genuinely do think it's okay despite me saying they "need to change" in my post. My interpretation of the system was that it was purely based on # of vests and therefore size of ones account... which is why the "red fish" and "minnow" being backwards will always bother my little mind. There's nothing to replace the "Whale" role with that would still make Hive seem crypto-oriented to a layperson even though the term was borrowed from Wall Street.

Hymenoptera names don't have the same appeal as the current, mostly marine, rankings do. I honestly couldn't come up with any decent sounding Hymenoptera names even after looking for minutes quite a while.

I honestly didn't expect a response, and I greatly appreciate a small look into your thoughts on the matter while setting this up for Hive after the fork. My post was an attempt to start a conversation on the matter and you responding is more than I could have asked for, thank you. It's all in good fun 🙂

At the very beginning, the minnow level was defined as having at least ~500 HP. This means lower users were... "nothing". The term "plankton" came way later and was hardly used when the red-fish was introduced.

I wanted something more friendly than nonmotile weak plankton to name this group of users and the small, unused to the big sea, Red Fish (Goldfish) came to my mind. The analogy with users (sometimes) unsuited to the crypto world was striking and funny to me.

As you say, it's all about fun.

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So far, I really like the ranks. It's easy for me to understand from a crypto perspective. And even if redfish and minnow are reversed in size, it's still an easily digestible chart.

I took a look at the hive-based animal chart he suggested and it's not really as easy to roll off the tongue. And Asian Giant Hornet kind of evokes a more menacing vibe than the neutral whale. Whales can be good or bad.

I would support a hive-based creature chart if it rolled off the tongue a little easier.

I guess we can be creative and find funny and easy to say names within the bee ecosystem, but we might miss the main goal of our "level" classification: to create a clear association with the amount of staked HIVE and the weight (understand influence) it has on the ecosystem.

That's true. I'm not sure how many life stages bees have but I don't think there's enough to cover all the levels lol. Larvae, Drone, Worker Bee, Queen Bee? Might not be as appealing for folks who don't want to be called "Queen Bee" XD

Queen bee? I don't know if it's worse to be called a drone? 😓 In my country it means lazy 🤭

I don't know, I really do not want to brainstorm myself with some nomenclature. whether whale or bees. If red fish is concern, just put it Plankton.
It is more of "accepted" system not something "officially" written in blockchain. so why so serious.

I really do not want to brainstorm myself

Why? This is super-cool! You get thousands of new (useless) ideas. 😭

Imagine if not only you have to have crypto knowledge but also be a marine biologist to understand Hive 😂 im on my way to become a dolphine and I wont have anything or anyone change that!

True, all the intricacies of Hive are hard enough to figure out.
No need to add another layer of complexity.

Looking forward to you becoming a dolphin 🐬

Wowww... Excelente amiga. Mis respetos 🤗🙏🏼🌻

Becoming a dolphin was awesome, and then I learned about all the other tokens being traded on HIVE. Now my money is split lol

I like the current set up, understandably moving to a hive based animal would be good but then we disassociate ourselves from Crypto by removing the whale.

Clearly ranks started at Whale and moved backwards. I like Dolphin and orca, I'm trying to buy my way into it lol

I love the system in place. I also love the fact that @branbello and @arcange can speak of their opinions so professionally. It makes me happy to know I'm part of this kind of system. For all, I know about marine biology these fish could be working in a hive.

ranks started at Whale and moved backward

Fully agree and this model can hardly be transposed to bees.

Probably you have not seen my suggestion for a new classification, based on ants not the worn out stinky fish analogy. A thriving ant hill is a much better analogy where all help together for a common goal, compared to the huge ocean where one fish feeds on another!
https://peakd.com/hive/@stayoutoftherz/proposal-for-a-new-hiver-classification-vorschlag-fuer-eine-neue-hiver-einteilung

I saw it. Level classification is an endless discussion and my guess is none will ever fit for all.

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Bang, I did it again... I just rehived your post!
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Hi @arcange I got more than 5,000 Hive, but I'm not marked as a "dolphin", do you know what the cause could be?

Levels are based on VESTS, not HP.
Dolphin level requires 1000000 VESTS, which is approximately 5000 HP.

If you look at your board, you will see that you still miss a few VESTS to reach the dolphin level.

Hive Power Up Day is coming. Might be the perfect time to make the jump 😉

thanks for the update and for the advice

Jamás pensé que con algo tan simple para recompensar o animar, pudiera existir una super explicación, 😊 bueno pasaba por aquí para saludar y verificar alguna noticia de hive buzz.Que tengo tiempo que no los veos en mis comentarios jajaj los extraño. Feliz fin de semana :)

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None of those matter anyway if you're just always a shark.