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RE: Why should I post my content on Hive?

in OCDlast year

Despite these pluses we struggle to recruit users. I did a Facebook post saying I would like to see more diversity in political opinions here. Steem/Hive attracted a lot of people from the so-called 'alt-right' as they stand a good chance of being blocked by other social media for spreading hatred and encouraging violence. The fact that they can operate freely here puts other people off. A friend who did join Steem is not keen to return due to this. He's a smart guy (psychology lecturer) and is well aware of the issues. If you look up topics like BLM you tend to find people dismissing it.

On the financial side new people will often struggle to make anything. This can be down to mis-understanding how it works. It is not necessarily about how hard you work on your posts as you only make dollars if big accounts give you votes. There are some curation projects that help to get votes to small accounts, but you do tend to see the same names on trending.

Talking of trending, I know some people have issues with it consisting largely of posts about Hive itself. Is that what will excite a new user? Or do they want to see art, photography, music or just good writing? I think a lot of established accounts (including mine) benefit from automatic votes. That is not necessarily the best way to earn from curation as the algorithm rewards those who find new stuff first.

You know I am a big fan of the platform, but we have to be realistic about the issues that hamper growth. It needs to be a compelling experience given that the rewards are unlikely to be great from the start. It is at least looking a lot better than Steem is now. It needs to look better than the big platforms too.

I keep saying we need a few 'influencers' with large followings to join. I know people are working on that. In some cases bringing 10% of their followers could more than double the active users on Hive. The issues there may be that they have to build an audience and they may be making more elsewhere. It may be better to get those with a few hundred or thousand followers who struggle to make anything on other platforms. Moving their activity here and bringing over their fans could benefit both sides.

I am not giving up. I am creating accounts for people who want them. Just need to find more who are interested.

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I feel that communities and dapps will help to address some of these issues, together with understanding Hive blockchain as an infrastructure for many things rather than the thing itself. As communities grow and become more sophisticated the Hive trending page will become less significant - people will become more focused on the trending page of the communities they are involved with.

The earnings thing is a bit of a red herring: the crux is about ownership and building ownership and value(s), and these are social value(s) as well as and as much as economic ones. It's helping people move from understanding Hive as an alternative spacebook/twitteringclasses/googletube to a different paradigm altogether with new affordances, some of which we can't even conceive or imagine yet. I agree it's not an easy task - but that is where the excitement lies :)

I think this is the latest in a series of really interesting posts which include the one about choosing where/how you consume and the political effect that has (I'll look for the link later); and the one about the creator/curator flippening.

Communities ought to play a part as people should be able to find the content they want and group together.

Earnings ought to be a bonus, but we need other compelling reasons to join up that appeal to people outside the niches where it has grown.

Excellent comment @Steevc especially regarding the political leanings here. The problem is, how can the balance be re-addressed when the platform is decentralised and censorship-free? It's quite the dichotomy.

The single most important thing to onboard the masses is simply down to the mobile experience which is close to non-existent here. I've banged on about it for years and it's no better than 3 years ago. I do wonder whether certain devs and whales actually want mass adoption as they seem quite comfortable on trending every day with a guaranteed income, there seems very little motivation to vastly increase the user base.

Again, auto voting I've whinged about for years. 'nuff said!

Some things don't seem to change much. eSteem is not a terrible mobile app, but it is all we have now. We do generally have a better set of whales than on Steem, but there is much that could be better and so we do not grow.

Steem/Hive attracted a lot of people from the so-called 'alt-right' as they stand a good chance of being blocked by other social media for spreading hatred and encouraging violence. The fact that they can operate freely here puts other people off.

Hopefully moderated communities will solve this; as they can stick to their community and others can stick to their own communities.

That said I have over 80k followers elsewhere (mostly on IG and FB) and have been unable to bring over more than a handful. The interfaces and sign up process are simply too hard. I love PeakD but its all currently aimed more at a reddit communities and bringing them over then short form social media. Communities and tribes solve some problems mentioned above but they also bring complexity. I had high hopes for APPICS but they have drifted away into their own token economics which is a great loss I think and had some interesting interface choices. Hopefully Dapplr will fill that spot soon and I will have a mobile interface that I can recommend to people because at the moment we have none that are equivalent in experience to legacy platforms (by a long way). The transition needs to be seamless. Most people are not on a crusade against 2nd generation social media; they just want to connect to their friends. The experience here needs to be at a minimum equivalent to 2nd gen or they will not come. We should steer clear of promoting rewards and rather promote that you own your follower base on the blockchain. I have had my reach cut from 30k per post to 10k per post on instagram when I was forced onto a "content creator" account. I now get requests to promote my posts to get the reach back that I had before organically. This is the main fear influencers have; and we should be targeting that. They are already monetizing their bases in other ways; we don't need to make the reward pool a big part of it (just a bonus). It is ownership of contact fan base which in the long run is the real benefit here.

Complexity of Hive is an issue, but Hive Keychain makes it relatively easy to use the various dapps. Communities could be better, especially the ability to discover them. There should be ways to suggest communities based on tags you use.

The big platforms are trying to monetise everything by making people pay to get reach. Hive ought to do better than that. It may just be about reaching some critical mass where it becomes interesting to outsiders, but we have to work to achieve that.

In response to this @steevc, I have an idea.

I'm not a developer, so I'm not sure if this would work, but I'm going to shoot it out there and see if it makes sense or if you guys think it would be possible. Here goes:

What if upon signing up for a new Hive account, the new users were prompted with a 'Hive Installation Package'?

Basically, their API would be prompted to 'allow access' to the installer. When they did, the installer would create a new directory in a specified location based on their OS - and place their new account keys in it.

Then, the installer would prompt the API to install 'Hive Keychain'. After the installation was complete, they would be prompted to 'allow access' to Hive Keychain so that it could import their new account keys from the specified directory that was created by the installer - and into their new Hive Keychain extension.

They then create a password for the Keychain, without ever having to mess with their keys.

The whole process for them would be 4 clicks. One to install, one to allow the installer to create the directory for their keys, one to install Keychain, and one to allow keychain to import the keys from the specified directory.

They would be up and ready to go engage with the Hive community, without having to do any complex import, or copy and pasting, which many don't understand.

I don't know if this would be possible or if it would compromise security.

Any thoughts?

There may be trust issues with this, but it should at least take the user through the steps of backing up their keys and setting up Keychain.

Okay, that's what I was wondering (if there would be trust issues). Taking the user through a simple process would sure be nice for them though. I remember when I first opened an account when we were on Steemit. The initial set up process required a fair amount of reading in comparison to what most people do today. It's difficult to keep reader attention in today's world. I meet this issue when I'm writing for websites. Very short paragraphs, address the question repeatedly, and make sure that you have headlines that stand out with so many lines clearly supporting the thesis it almost feels redundant (in some articles). If the audience doesn't feel like their questions are answered with the most minimal effort from them - it's "NEXT!"

The fact that they can operate freely here puts other people off.

Yet, communities are owned and can segment experience. I find it crazy that people want to police the entire internet, even though they only spend time in a fragment of it themselves.

It is not necessarily about how hard you work on your posts as you only make dollars if big accounts give you votes.

Over time though, it really, really, really does matter. If an account isn't consistently producing what the audience wants, it is unlikely they will consistently get support.

but you do tend to see the same names on trending.

While a lot of those names will disappear over time, what will happen is that the ones that are often there will be those who contribute. Currently, we are still very narrowly focused, but those that are there are actually contributors - it is just that creators don't count developers as creators :) I actually think that if you look at some of the creatives that are there, they are the most active and engaged, plus they put out better than average content that people enjoy.

Is that what will excite a new user? Or do they want to see art, photography, music or just good writing?

Potentially. Content is everywhere, content that gives people support to invest and possibly earn might actually be more valuable for new users on Hive. This can change over time, but currently YouTube, Instagram, DeviantArt or Medium (or whatever else) is full of content... what sets Hive apart is the economic capabilities owned by the community itself.

The issues there may be that they have to build an audience and they may be making more elsewhere.

Yes, until...

It may be better to get those with a few hundred or thousand followers who struggle to make anything on other platforms.

The real value of the other platforms isn't in the stars, it is in who the stars attract - the "wannabe" stars. They build up the accounts by mimicking others and the platform leverages their network and drives the value to themselves and distributes a little to the stars to encourage them to attract more wannabes. The system is rigged.

No platform is perfect, not even Hive. It has tended to attract those who are into crypto already, so there is a lot about that. I find plenty of music, comics and other stuff I enjoy, so I don't feel so much need to go to other places for those.

I could also have mentioned that only being able to earn in the first week is a problem, but the peakd tipping feature may make that less of an issue.

I support the sort of content I want to see more of rather than fishing for curation rewards. Some of the people I vote on do get some good votes from Curie etc. I would hope they tell their friends. We need to know when they sign up. That is part of why I do the #FollowFriday posts. There are cool accounts with 12 followers who get hardly any comments. Comments can matter as much as votes.

Keep it social! Life is not just about money.

Yepp, I definitely believe that comment matters as much as votes.

If I get more comments on my post....I am okay with very less rewards.

I want that human interaction. A lot of the votes I get are automated, so I appreciate it when someone actually looks at the post.

Yepp, me too.

I could also have mentioned that only being able to earn in the first week is a problem, but the peakd tipping feature may make that less of an issue.

I think that this will change in time too, through second layer solutions.

Comments can matter as much as votes.

I agree completely, which is why over the years I have put so much effort into replying to comments. I am quite tired of commenting on young accounts and not getting a reply at all. -I am sure they are hoping/expecting some reward on their content though.

I can definitely relate to your point of autovotes not being the best way of growth.

I feel that people will put more effort in their post if everything is curated manually.

Maybe a lot more posts that were not rewarded at all will get some rewards.

I find it thrilling that even if one out of 10 posts do good.

On the other hand, if I know that all of my posts will earn, say 5$. I will not put any more or less effort in content.

Anyway, I am enjoying the hive experience.

And things will improve with time.

I hope they do.

In my early days of Steem I had lots of posts that made nothing at all, but that gradually changed as I built connections with people. It can be a lot about who you know. I had hopes that communities would help matters, but it is still early days.

I feel that people will put more effort in their post if everything is curated manually.

Some will, many will just do what they do now regardless.

Maybe a lot more posts that were not rewarded at all will get some rewards.

Potentially, or people will close their circles even more tightly. In the past and before most of the auto options were available, the voting was very, very narrow.

On the other hand, if I know that all of my posts will earn, say 5$. I will not put any more or less effort in content.

I think you would find that "real content creators" (people who value their work, not just the votes) will put in effort regardless. I know that at the moment I will get decent votes, but I have produced content like this or of higher standard for far, far less. As said above, people who value their own content, will produce despite rewards.

There is a long way to go in many areas for sure.

 last year 

Most people aren't posters.

Keep telling them post to Hive is pointless. It's like telling a bunch of people that they need to write a book. Most people will say no thank you.

I’m willing to bet that most still believe this is a blog only platform.

Can we change the message a bit? Like maybe support who you like indefinitely? I'm sure people like @nonameslefttouse of said similar things.

Actual content. That's the stuff your normal everyday social media consumer views and shares. Not everyone produces content. The glaring majority consume it. Over the years I've produced many instances of actual content. This is a content production platform, much like how Youtube is a content production platform. This is not Facebook or Twitter. That's where people go to view, consume, share, and talk about actual content. The consumer content is usually comments under actual content or personal info like a status message, home videos and photos. Short, impulsive, opinion based comments/reactions to actual content.

Hive does not have a market for actual content. I see the steady flow of "onboarding effort posts" but those people are not consumers, which is what this platform lacks. From the content creator perspective, I see far too many complaints from other content creators. If my consumers support my work consistently, that's a sign of a success in this industry. Then I see people talk about how noobs should earn by default (supposed to take years to grow a following of consistent consumers) and those with large stake consistently trending "should not see as much support," meaning anyone who is new today has nothing to work up to since they too will eventually find some measure of success and that success will be frowned upon. You can visit Youtube and see many of the same accounts trending consistently, they are also the wealthiest top earners, nobody complains, since that's what they want to work up to, and the majority of users are consumers who see success as a good thing as well. Nobody complains when members shitpost or share actual content they liked in Facebook groups then consistently get the most likes... yet for some reason, here, rather than folks working to build their consumer base and support group, they want to tap in to what others built, and feel entitled to the same results as anyone seeing success.

It seems many here want to attract casual, everyday content consumers/social media users. They then want to take their content, convert that into actual content and lead them on to expect rewards for the consumer style posts. Meanwhile the actual content creators are already dying for an actual audience. Hive pays those consumers with comment votes and consumer rewards, but those people are not prepped to be content with earning less than an actual content creators. Even some of the "local experts" around here think those consumers should earn what top trenders earn with their consumer style content which is ridiculous. People who would be better suited at filling the role of consumer, which should outnumber creators here 1000 to 1, they end up leaving since earning a few Hive per month consuming "isn't enough and not fair" even though that's way more than what they earned in twenty years consuming elsewhere. This place needs to attract those dedicated paying consumers. People who are happy to earn low rewards for shitposts, liking posts, and commenting. Meanwhile, actual content creators need to be able to find success and not be treated like shit for it. Some of these blind autovotes are ridiculous while those posts don't even get comments. As for those receiving top notch engagement regularly on top of those auto votes... well, if there were more dedicated consumers here, I would have hundreds if not thousands more comments under those posts, and so would many others. I'd also see a raise in pay... and so would everyone else. If people continue to complain about these things... we're going nowhere. Pardon my rambles...

A lot of people would comment and vote/like. If there is content they can enjoy here then they can be earning even if they don't post.

 last year 

Do the outside world know that?

Do they know there's more to Hive than blogging?

Most of them have never heard of it. That's the first barrier.

Couldn't say it better. Objectiveness will ultimately help our platform realize its flaws, as well as its pros, and become awhat we wish for years. Currently it's an improvement over Steem, but we still need some radical changes. As I said multiple times before I would definitely ditch autovotes, I would make wallets private and would change the algorithm for how posts get to trending. There are more others that would need a change but lets not forget what makes this platform at least a good one, and that's posting and curating rewards that most of the mainstream ones don't offer and being blockchain based it gets even better.

If you look up topics like BLM you tend to find people dismissing it.

This is depressing, luckily the circle I follow and get followed from doesn't seem to have that opinion. I haven't checked trending in ages, and if I do I check the art usually. I stopped checking that since I it used to demotivate me completely, so i don't check.
However, if at some point I felt that alt-right was almost everyone I interact with (and if the platform becomes associated with that), I would quit (I wouldn't be surprised if others would too), the money isn't worth it.

My contacts are generally good people and I rarely have to see the hateful stuff. I know a lot of people here like to take an 'alternative' view, but that does not have to mean dismissing any efforts to resolve divisive politics.

i think onboarding is the biggest problem and reason for slow growth. complicated registration process kills even the most keen average user, sometimes even seasoned IT people just give up. just too much gymnastics. we fix that we will grow then fold. I personally know of tons of friends, family, colleagues that i introduced who have just given up. and unless i do the entire registration process and then just hand them the account once done, most of the people i sold the platform to, just decided it was not worth the effort after trying to do the registration themselves.

We need good tutorials to walk them through getting set up. Getting Keychain and setting up the keys is not too hard and then most things are simple as you can use the various dapps. Not so easy on mobile and we need a better experience there. eSteem/ecency is good, but we need others.

Since i posted comment I stumbled across this site
https://hiveonboard.com/

seems pretty straight forward, have not tested though

That is a useful site. I have created accounts for people using those I claimed and then I delegate to them. We need resources they can look at to learn how things work.

Little correction:

Steem/Hive attracted a lot of people accused of being from the so-called 'alt-right' as they stand a good chance of being blocked by other social media for being accused of spreading hatred and encouraging violence.

The actual alt right is tiny. However, the mere accusation of having those accused of being far right on the platform is enough to put people off. So the problem is still there.

I think with some of these people it is pretty obvious where their politics are. I know some of them are crafty to avoid explicit racism and will try to dress it up as journalism. I am more interested in people who want to bring us together than those who try to drive us apart. You cannot fully define an individual by their race which they did not get to choose.

It may be better to get those with a few hundred or thousand followers who struggle to make anything on other platforms. Moving their activity here and bringing over their fans could benefit both sides.

It's interesting, we have had a fair few people with large followings on Youtube and other platforms talk about Steem over the years. Aside from DollarVigilante and some others in the anarcho-capitalist space as well as Jerry Banfield, it doesn't seem like any of them ever really brought many followers over with them.

I agree that the alt-right and to a lesser extent the anarcho-capitalist leanings here turn off a mainstream audience. I think this can be improved with more focus put on communities (moving away from trending as the front page on Hive websites). Ideally communities should be broad interest categories, not the weird list of communities that we have at the top now (it's hard to even know what some of them are about based on their names). The top two communities now are "curation", "high quality original content" communities.. which is borderline meaningless to most people.

I think those Youtubers did bring in a lot of people, but only a hardcore bunch have stuck with us through the ups and downs.

Communities are a bit of a mess. Perhaps peakd could suggest communities to look at based on the tags you use. There could be more intelligent use of tags as a lot of them are pretty pointless.

I also don't like those 'curation' communities. Nobody is going to go looking for content to actually read/watch/listen there. There is too much emphasis on strategic voting and not enough on real engagement.

I am not giving up. I am creating accounts for people who want them. Just need to find more who are interested.

I shared some of my hive contents to some SM groups. I have been able to invite a couple of people. However, I get weared with having to delegate my HP. I just gave someone alink to create his account, but I am a little worried I will delegate some HP before he /she can post. Any solution to this by the team?

You can always take back a delegation. A small one can at least get people going. If they show promise you could increase it.

I enjoy being censored/banned from the progressive mainstream social platforms. It's primarily to me a "badge of honor" to get memholed or outright banned from the twitterverse after 12years.

I don't want to get to a place where echo chambers are created.

Opposing viewpoints are valuable too.

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