Getting into dirty money

in LeoFinance2 months ago

Why is it that speaking about money is seen with such cultural negativity?

As I see it, the "taboo" topics that are not to be publicly discussed are also the things where we have the most friction with others, the least understanding of others and often, the most issues and questions ourselves. Instead of having conversations on things like religion, politics, sex and money with those around us, we are encouraged to stay silent and instead make assumptions about people and processes. When we make assumptions, we tend to think that they are accurate be default.

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A couple hours ago while sitting at the office, a colleague turned around from the desk in front and asked if I had been keeping an eye on crypto lately. After a couple of discussions in the past, he had decided to take the plunge (after years of interest on the sidelines) and buy a little Bitcoin and Ethereum - Just before it took a dive down to the recent lows. However, now it is about 30% up on where he bought and he is pretty happy - other than the "I shoulda waited" regrets.

What I find interesting is that this is a conversation that took place when no one else was around and in hushed tones, like what we were talking about is socially unacceptable - because it is. It isn't acceptable to talk about money or investing socially with people we aren't very well acquainted, as to do so is seen as base behavior, showing off or perhaps exclusionary against those who can't afford to invest.

The problem that I have with this cultural rule is that not discussing it openly is the exclusionary position, as most people on earth do not have much experience with economic or financial process knowledge - even though all are participants. The difference between a kid raised in an environment that increases financial knowhow or not, can be quite profound on life later.

When applied to a new technology or financial vehicle like Bitcoin and blockchain, it slows down the uptake through a lack of awareness, but also encourages assumption-based decision making, with many of the assumptions being built on poor information sources, including movies. There is a lot of FUD out there which is reported by "reliable" sources that people, by which people are influenced.

Now, while we were talking, another colleague (a close friend of the other) overheard and then we started talking about various aspects of it. He himself is an investor who has been playing with stocks (including startups) for years - and a few minutes later, he set himself up with a Coinbase account.

What is interesting is that we have been talking about this stuff for a year and a half already (when BTC was 3500-ish), but he never took the plunge. Once there was a little social proof through the discussion, it took minutes to make the decision.

A lot of what holds people out of investing isn't necessarily the lack of funds, it is the lack of support to make the move and the feeling that one is alone as an investor. This increases the personal responsibility, but also the feeling of risk. When there is a group of close friends doing similar, there is more sense of the, "win together, fail together" mentality as well as a bit of peer pressure and FOMO.

With more open discussion around topics, the topics themselves lose their taboo status and get normalized in society. When this is applied to the hidden pain points of our life like financial issues, it demystifies the processes as well as allows people an open forum to discuss and develop their own opinions and methodology. I think open discussion is a major strength of Hive as it brings all kinds of people into the fold as a community and encourages them to discover what many people never do - Investing isn't scary.

There are risks of course, but as long as one has a good understanding, the potential for loss is a known limit - with the potential for gain being the unknown variable. You can only lose what you put in and if one only plays with value that they are already willing t lose completely - there is no reason to fear.

What was also interesting in the discussion is that the person who had bought BTC earlier was really enjoying the game of investing - the looking at the apps and the price and speculating on the ups and downs. He said that for the amount he put in, even if he loses it all, he has enjoyed the learning about the scene and loves the ability to interact more directly with his investment more often.

Again, a good sign for the future of Hive, where ownership and active participation is encouraged and counted as part of the investment.

Taraz
[ Gen1: Hive ]

Posted Using LeoFinance

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A few years ago I was day trading futures contracts. I spent several months studying and paper trading and finally opened an account in a US broker and started trading ETF futures on the CME (Chicago Mercantile Exchange) as well as Eurex.
Soon I discovered the only way to manage trading is controlling your mind. I read many trading psychology books and all of them started explaining how it is our relationship with money which is quite different than the relationship we have with the rest of the matters of our life.

We have fear when we do not understand what we are dealing with, this is what I experience from others when I encourage relatives to enter the crypto world with a very small investment to familiarize themselves with it. Then if we are lucky and succeed we feel we are experts and some of us (included me when I was trading) end up losing as we risk too much. When that happens we feel miserable and do not want to share the experience with anyone, similar to the feeling of anyone entering the crypto market to invest for the first time has when the price goes down.

We are all used to money but very few of us understand and are aware of the emotions it produces in us. From all the books I read, there is one, the very first one I was told to read, which does not teach you about technical analysis or trading, it just makes you understand how your mind processes the emotions you feel when you trade, many of them are the same no matter if you trade daily, for long term or just invest.

The name of the book is Trading in the zone by Mark Douglas, I encourage anyone curious about this matter to read it. I've done it several times as it is not one of those books you read fast, you need to process all the words while reading as it is quite profound.

The emotion surrounding money is a huge factor and was one of the things that has continually plagued me. Scarcity mindset. Since coming to crypto 3.5 years ago, I have worked hard to change my thinking around it and slowly I am finding ways to break my cycles and generate, rather than try to hold onto it.

When that happens we feel miserable and do not want to share the experience with anyone,

We fear losing - we might fear looking like losers even more.

Thanks for the link :)

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Dirty little secrets, dirty little lies.

I spent 68 years as a woman's deepest secret. When the light hit it I found a loving family. I honestly don't have much use for them. Secrets.

Taboos tend to be the same to me, except it seems to me that a taboo REALLY favors the person that breaks it. Dirty little secrets.

I have to tell you that I'd have been better served with a bit more enlightenment and education on things financial. Almost every lesson I learned was at the school of hard knocks. It's another one of those dirty little secrets that keeps the plebes under control. And we both know the plebes must be kept under control.

I'm not much of a gambler, but from time to time I am a player. Every time I go to a Casino or Horse Race track I visualize every cent I have as gone. If I bring money home it's a win for me...

I spent 68 years as a woman's deepest secret. When the light hit it I found a loving family.

Pretty crazy, isn't it?

except it seems to me that a taboo REALLY favors the person that breaks it.

Yep - and those who have a reason to enforce it.

It's another one of those dirty little secrets that keeps the plebes under control. And we both know the plebes must be kept under control.

People think money is to buy stuff - the majority of it in the world is used to control the people who think it is to buy stuff.

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Financial education is an important topic. There should be a lot more of it at home and in school. What I disagree on is the idea that people don't discuss finances or investing. It's very easy to find discussion forums on the internet about investing.

Those discussions in forums aren't peer groups, they are strangers. It is a massive difference as a source of influence and also requires an active search. Without the right culture, most wouldn't even look.

Without the right culture, most wouldn't even look.

That's true.

When there is a group of close friends doing similar, there is more sense of the, "win together, fail together" mentality as well as a bit of peer pressure and FOMO.

I think many people don't have the courage to invest, or better yet, to take responsibility for their action. If there's a group of friends, half of which have already invested, it's easier for the rest to join in as they think "win together, fail together" as you said. This has a double meaning. 1. If the others are also in, you don't look stupid if you lose. 2. If you lose, you can partly blame the others for your failure. Looks strange but it's true. People are reticent because they want some kind of proof first.

  1. If the others are also in, you don't look stupid if you lose.

This is a very big point most people don't realise. People aren't just scared of losing, they are scared of looking like losers.

Do you remember when Steem dropped under $1? How many people bought Steem at $0.75 - S0.9 as compared to $4 or even $8, looked like a good investment, a golden opportunity. I remember the posts saying I bought x Steem and powered up, one after another. They were not so quick to admit how much they have lost though. There were a few honest posts, but not many. That was similar.

The first I bought was around 1.80 on the way up - and I held all the way down - My account was 1/8th the size it is now and was worth 4 times as much :)

😁 oooops

I get that it's frowned upon and I don't care.
Listen, don't listen; just never say I kept it all a secret.

If it goes big, you never told them firmly enough.

Invest is easy until you decide to put in your hard earned money. It is beneficial to have friends to share and discuss which gives you positive energy and support.

Invest is easy until you decide to put in your hard earned money.

I think it actually makes it easier (my experience) as there is more incentive to actually learn.

It is true! That's all you said, but there is also a kind of "secrecy" with the other for fear that the golden goose will be plucked. I have seen that there are people who do not talk about the source of money, out of pure selfishness. As if the well were going to run out. Likewise, in some countries, some businesses are not seen as "legal", so they keep a low profile. Personally I agree with you, if you could talk freely about some things, sex, money, there would be less ignorance and maybe, less mistakes and more initiative. Good Tuesday, @tarazkp

I have seen that there are people who do not talk about the source of money, out of pure selfishness.

Yes. As I said above, money is generally used as a control mechanism, and if everyone has enough - they are hard to control.

The difference between a kid raised in an environment that increases financial knowhow or not, can be quite profound on life later.

If you have parents that openly discussed and practiced good money habits then this is a HUGE advantage, even if you don't inherit money from them. The knowledge you accumulate from consistent conversations at the dinner table can be life changing.

Even when young, I wished my parents were better with money - or at least, better at building the knowledge around it.

People think money is to buy stuff - the majority of it in the world is used to control the people who think it is to buy stuff.

There is the sad and awful truth.

Very interesting story. But, did you tell these colleagues about Hive and why? Sorry for this not very correct question :)

They know about it yes - but they are not ready to make the leap - it is funny, people seem scared of the idea :)

i know i had some bitcoins and sell them all low around 9000$ when i thought they are goona take deep dive now i see i was wrong and bitcoin price jump to 11000$

Well, depending at where you bought them, you should be fine enough if you had a few ;D

I think personally it is kind of bad that any discussion of money and investing is shunned in average society. I can see why it would be (since there's a lot of people that struggle financially and so don't want to be embarrassed), but the problem then is that people don't get exposed to helpful advice regarding money and investing. I think such conversations should be more open.

I wonder if the embarrassment is a result of the social conditioning, rather than it being an "actual" response. For example in Finland (where I live), people are far more open about not having money to do something.

I have to say that the major problem over here is lack of information! I cannot overemphasize on the damage that it has caused over time and the effect that is still to come as a result of it. You see over here, corruption and scheming is the order of the day and so everybody is sceptical of EVERYTHING! So combine that fact plus the misinformation or lack of information and you have a recipe for disaster.

You see over here, corruption and scheming is the order of the day and so everybody is sceptical of EVERYTHING!

Do you think that because of this circumstance, normal people are more likely to scheme themselves?

Not necessarily. There are a lot of factors involved i guess. Literacy, beliefs and even religion.

I count these things as part of the culture and there are large differences between the way people apply "rules" to their life. For example, one person could devote themselves to charity, the other could shoot and rob people in the street - each could have a silver cross hanging from a chain around their neck.

Hahaha, over here they call crypto Monopoly money and if you dare mention it else they think you are a bit dippy.
We have many syndicates and crooks here that rip the people off and there is a great fear of anything that is not deposited into one of our happy major banks.

For some months now I have been trying to talk a young neigbor into opening a Hive account.
He is self employed with two small children and he builds websites for a living.
So, I told him to put his small business on Hive and that clients can pay him in crypto. It can certianly help him and his family, but thus far no go, not yet.

"The difference between a kid raised in an environment that increases financial knowhow or not, can be quite profound on life later".

Indeed it can be quite profound later to learn that you have struggled the old fashioned hard way to work for your money and that the only way to make progress was to depend for growth on the pitiful interest rates from the bank. What a waste of time and money!

We have many syndicates and crooks here that rip the people off and there is a great fear of anything that is not deposited into one of our happy major banks.

crooks to the left of me, crooks to the right - stuck in the middle with you... :D

What a waste of time and money!

And life.

Here you are, stuck in the middle with me :)

Agreed that it's a waste of life, but thankfully I have always done private jobs on the side to keep us going. Now I am getting too old, as they say that I have muscle degeneration, but of course I keep on going!
Tried investing once via a "professional" and burnt my fingers lol.

Hello @tarazkp this comment is to ask you some questions hope you will answer them

How can I increase my reputation do I need more HP for it

Back 2 3 week ago I joined upvotebank for vote is n my posts is there any trouble with using such service

reputation is built through getting votes. Hopefully, other people voting on you. It is affected by how much HP and how high their reputation is. For example, my reputation and HP have a pretty big relative affect on other people's reputation scores. The higher the reputation climbs though, the harder it is to increase. Each level is 1.5x harder than the last - so for my account as an example, my reputation score takes something like 8 months of me posting consistently and getting consistent votes to go from 80-81.

I have no idea what upvotebank is

so i have engage with other hivers with high repution can you recommend some user like you @tarazkp who love to engage with there community and what is that witness thing how can i become witness and its benefits

Not really - the best way is to find people you enjoy and have some fun. The reputation number is mostly useless for the average user.

sure now I get it I gust have to enjoy and have fun and talk to like-minded people
thanks @tarazkp

You're right: there's not too much education about money, even though we're all participants in the money system. Why don't we receive education about money in the education system?