Why is "for-profit" not bad? - Arguments against Etatism/ Interventionism and for Austrian School/ Agorism

woelfchen in #economy • 9 months ago (edited)

I've just written the following text as reply to this by @earthcustodians but then decided to make a little post out of it.

I agree with almost all of ur points, except:

And the only way to stop this is to realize that a for-profit society isn't the answer.

In an open, libertarian free market society which would be a decentralized, self-regulating economy and life, this wouldn't be a problem.

For-profit is bad atm cuz everything is regulated, even money (which should be a product of the market), and now they need to find new ways for their planned economy.. (just printing money isnt worth anything, they gotta back it with something - with military, big-pharma, regulating states, jura, every industry .. and so on - and they really need new ways cuz they are in a dead end)

And all the new ways of making profit we see are just new established ways of their planned economy. But that doesn't mean for profit is bad in general!

If they wouldn't regulate science and economy, old knowledge and plant-based psychedelics would be extremely superior.

They are decentralized. All of those just grow in the garden. And shamans would pop up everywhere, cuz people are interested, want to know how to handle stuff.

CUZ

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But people ain't allowed.

Sadly we still have witch hunt..

And for-profit would also not be a problem.. just like natural business.
Cuz in a natural state (real market economy) prices are a precious and precise measurement unit.
That's why bitcoin (as product of free market) is so strong now. We need a basis again. A good measurement unit..

Being in profit or not would in free markets just be an indication if u're doing/producing/contributing something which is being valued or not..
For-profit would just mean you do something people ask/want and are willing to pay you for..

I can heartly recommend you austrian school (marxism or keynianism is a bad joke against it) - Ludwig von Mises and Friedrich August Hayek

We need to dismantle the "you need to be allowed" and go to self-responsibility.

photo_20200727_012818 2.jpg

Corona, status quo, etatism, interventionism, they money system, they all show us which way not to go. And that's the centralized authority way - but I guess I don't have to tell you that, you already are on Hive ;)

A last argument against government:
If their product would be superior they could just offer it to the free market, like every other person or company, instead of imposing it on everybody. But those bureaucrats know that private companies would make their job not only better, but also without taxing and slaving the whole world..

Even if they say they do it for our safety!

#science #society #life #informationwar #anarchy #austrianschool #palnet #decentralization #agorism

9 months ago in #economy by woelfchen

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woelfchen 9 months ago

@tipu curate

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tipu 9 months ago

Upvoted 👌 (Mana: 14/21)

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hivebuzz 9 months ago

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antisocialist 9 months ago

As long as rule by force comes off the options list, I don't care what you do, but if 'money' is to persist, it must not be regulated except by the acceptees, imo.

Here is a book that outlines what we are expecting the future to resemble when we say moneyless.

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woelfchen 9 months ago

so how do you wanna run your country? or a ur household or little business without money?

like in communism?

you should read austrian school instead of harvard..

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antisocialist 9 months ago

https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/petr-kropotkin-the-conquest-of-bread.pdf

https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/petr-kropotkin-anarchist-communism-its-basis-and-principles

And you should read the original communists.

This one is easier to read than the other two.
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/alexander-berkman-what-is-communist-anarchism

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woelfchen 9 months ago (edited)

I asked you.

Thanks, but I've read enough about communism, socialism, marxism, keynianism
so I already know the first two..

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antisocialist 9 months ago

Do you?

I'll bet you one hbd that you don't know any of those authors.
Without them, you don't know communism, you know its bastardization.

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woelfchen 9 months ago (edited)

I've read them and know ancom - liked that
I don't like communism, way too much died cuz of Stalin, Lenin, Mao and it's not to help people like us

ancom is more the right way, but still doesnt practically work in larger scale - the market is missing

ancap / libertarism/ agorism with free market economies (austrian school) works and scales (you can see that in bitcoin) - still it didnt manage to really manifest yet cuz people (govs, anti-market communists/ socialists - basically people who have no clue and are afraid of illusions created by their leaders) always fight against it and intervene in market mechanisms

interventionism / etatism is the status quo.

just let go

there can both be ancap and ancom communities simultaneously, while profiting from each other - still I now tell you ancap, libertarism, btc, austrian school will run the world cuz it scales (you also know that - or why do you want bitcoin or hive?)

but it's a long way to go

that's also why I focus on active doing, instead of sitting around reading books, atm

I've read enough and know what I want and where to go
thanks for the hbd :P

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antisocialist 9 months ago

way too much died cuz of Stalin, Lenin, Mao

https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/emma-goldman-there-is-no-communism-in-russia

You really should read the books I give you, it is hard to confront ignorance, especially when willful.

An-crap is a contradiction in terms.
Anarchists never supported crapitalsim, historically.
It is a bastardization in an attempt to appeal to the ignorant among both.

https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/the-anarchist-faq-editorial-collective-an-anarchist-faq-07-17

I've read enough and know what I want and where to go
thanks for the hbd :P

If education was easy, everybody would have one, imo.

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woelfchen 9 months ago (edited)

dude. crapitalism IS NOT capitalism and free market economy.

it is hard to confront ignorance, especially when willful.

yes. it is.
That's why you should learn about free market economy.. but you don't want to.

I don't care anymore.

Do what you gotta do.

Yea. there never was any communism ever anywhere. especially not in ussr LOOLLLL

that's also why the communist long-time plan doesnt destroy europe atm - oh it does? how if it didnt exist?

stop the bullshit.

you always say stop following orders. SO WHY THE FUCK ARE YOU AGAINST FREE MARKET ECONOMY?!?!?!?! and therefore free human action?

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woelfchen 9 months ago

http://thegarrisoncenter.org/archives/15244

what do you say?

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antisocialist 9 months ago

Economics was invented as a way to keep people that can math busy while the banksters robbed those that can't math.

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woelfchen 9 months ago

That's cuz you only know marxism and keynianism

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antisocialist 9 months ago

I've never read Marx, and have no interest in doing so.
I have read the austrian skool, and that is why I answered as I did.

If you haven't been made aware of those authors I've listed, as I can tell from your argument that you haven't, then please catch up to the rest of class.

Thinking outside the box starts with thoughts from outside it, all I've heard from you I heard in the box before I got out.

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woelfchen 9 months ago (edited)

stop defending people who "can't math" or as I say don't want to learn and grow up

everyone needs to take self-responsibility

learning math and basic market economy isn't hard.
with freedom of contract, private property (which can't be taken away if we abolish theft) and the will to create wealth, you can do that

but atm they tax and regulate you to death

we finally need real capitalism/ free market economies, not that market intervening or etatist robbery shit.

you should read marx. and then inform yourself how they starved in ussr cuz they've expropriated the farms from the evil capitalists and gave them to people without knowledge

they had land, farm, all machines and even got money from the communists to buy what they need.
noone knew what to do, how to handle a farm, they just took what they saw and when there was nothing left they left and the starving started

have you read mises and hayek? they are pillars of austrian school

I don't believe you that, cuz if so, you'd know https://b-ok.cc/book/2611647/ce8ff5

and that's not just philosophy like ancap, ancom, kropotkin etc
but real methodical science

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woelfchen 9 months ago

I and We

The Ego is the unity of the acting being. It is unquestionably given and cannot be dissolved or conjured away by any reasoning or quibbling.
The We is always the result of a summing up which puts together two or more Egos. If somebody says I, no further questioning is necessary in order to establish the meaning. The same is valid with regard to the Thou and, provided the person in view is precisely indicated, with regard to the He. But if a man says We, further information is needed to denote who the Egos are who are comprised in this We. It is always single individuals who say We; even if they say it in chorus, it yet remains an utterance of single individuals.
The We cannot act otherwise than each of them acting on his own behalf. They can either all act together in accord; or one of them may act for them all. In the latter case the cooperation of the others consists in their bringing about the situation which makes one man's action effective for them too. Only in this sense does the officer of a social entity act for the whole; the individual members of the collective body either cause or allow a single man's action to concern them too.
The endeavors of psychology to dissolve the Ego and to unmask it as an illusion are idle. The praxeological Ego is beyond any doubts. No matter what a man was and what he may become later, in the very act of choosing and acting he is an Ego.
From the pluralis logicus (and from the merely ceremonial pluralis majestaticus) we must distinguish the pluralis gloriosus. If a Canadian who never tried skating says, “We are the world's foremost ice hockey players,” or if an Italian boor proudly contends “We are the world's most eminent painters,” nobody is fooled. But with reference to political and economic problems the pluralis gloriosus evolves into the pluralis imperialis and as such plays a significant role in paving the way for the acceptance of doctrines determining international economic policies.

out of Human Action by Mises

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antisocialist 9 months ago

Freud was a coke dealing fraud.
He did a good job with defining behaviors, but his aim was not the improvement of the average.
I can point you to better material.

Build your castle on sand, don't be surprised when the water washes it away.

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antisocialist 9 months ago

but real methodical science

https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/petr-kropotkin-fields-factories-and-workshops-or-industry-combined-with-agriculture-and-brain-w

Would you like to restate your position?

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woelfchen 9 months ago (edited)

If everyone took his share of production, and if production were socialised — as political economy, if it aimed at the satisfaction of the ever-growing needs of all, would advise us to do — then more than one half of the working day would remain to everyone for the pursuit of art, science, or any hobby he or she might prefer; and his work in those fields would be the more profitable if he spent the other half of the day in productive work — if art and science were followed from mere inclination, not for mercantile purposes. Moreover, a community organised on the principles of all being workers would be rich enough to conclude that every man and woman, after having; reached a certain age — say of forty or more — ought to be relieved from the moral obligation of taking a direct part in the performance of the necessary manual work, so as to be able entirely to devote himself or herself to whatever he or she chooses in the domain of art, or science, or any kind of work. Free pursuit in new branches of art and knowledge, free creation, and free development thus might be fully guaranteed.. And such a community would not know misery amidst wealth. It would not know the duality of conscience which permeates out life and stifles every noble effort. It would freely take its flight towards the highest regions of progress compatible with human nature.

"if if if if if all are kind and work as I say they should and everything was socialised and political.... we had utopia"

do it. just do it. and stop getting on the nerves of people working for free and open, self-regulating markets

you should have something to do. but that's not what people want.

It would freely take its flight towards the highest regions of progress compatible with human nature.

yaya. it would just be utopia - for everyone. without knowledge at all..

this last sentence just shows why praxeology is so important.
Just read human action by mises or don't, I don't even care.
Everyone is the architect of his own fortune

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earthcustodians 8 months ago

The problem is that monetarism/money is very coercive. Many people wouldn't do what they do if it were for what they perceive as safer. It often turns out that they choose for a quick fix that comes along with more problems

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